How To Change Careers When You’re Multi Passionate

Ep 42 Katie O'Malley (Finished)

===

[: 00:00:00

s, and a sneaky lie that you [: 00:01:00

So grab your coffee, get comfy. This is a convo you don't want to miss.

Theresa: Welcome, Katie.

Katie: Theresa, thank you so much for having me on your podcast and giving me the opportunity to connect with you and your audience.

Theresa: Oh my God, I am so excited for this conversation with you. And I want to start at the beginning and hear a little bit about you and your career story.

I'm wondering, did you always know that you wanted to be a coach and a leadership educator, or was that a winding road that brought you to where you are today? It was very

Katie: much the latter, um, very much a winding road. So, um, I really describe myself as a bit of a career nomad, but with the thread of altruism pulling through my entire career.

[: 00:02:00

duated in an election year in: 2004

Um, I was like, okay, it is a full time W 2 employee job. Um, there's going to be more security and stability here, even though the compensation isn't necessarily in alignment with the value that we provide to society. but moved from Minneapolis to New York City. And I spent several years, , working for an organization called the Innocence Project, um, engaging in fundraising and development.

for analysis at the time of [: 00:04:00

Um, when back in the nineties and before no one DNA, was not a thing that was being used. And it was my job alongside my boss to raise the money to pay for the testing, the legal fees. And then of course, folks who have been in prison, um, who, who come out, um, a whole, a whole new world exists, right? So a lot of these men, and it was the majority, uh, men, went in at 16, 17, 18 years old coming out in their 40s, 50s, 60s, and not only are they coming out to limited family and community, but a world that did not exist.

[: 00:05:00

Um, while the work itself I knew was very, very impactful and, and changing lives, and we're also changing systems and policies, it's very hard to live in New York city on any salary, much less a nonprofit salary. And so came home to Chicago, which is where I'm chatting to you from today and started working at the AIDS.

it was because of salary and [: 00:06:00

What I did do was see a lot of my friends having a great amount of success in commercial real estate. And I'm like, well, if they can do it, I can do this too. Um, not taking into account the things that make me feel a sense of competence at work, the things that make me feel a sense of community. And had I visited with a career coach or career counselor, Theresa, they would have said, Hey, there's a values discrepancy here between what you're bringing to the table and the values of the industry.

working for were on the same [: 00:07:00

And I went back to my old employer on that day to have lunch with my old colleagues because I knew I had made an incredible misstep. But I was raised in a family system where we grit we don't quit. Um, and we also do not quit a job until we have another job lined up, which is not my approach or methodology when working with others today, but it was at that time and.

I don't know if this has happened to you where you've been in a company, an organization and an environment where your feelings and your thoughts and your behaviors couldn't be aligned with what you really believed in order to actually belong and get rewarded within that system. And so. The three and a half years that I worked there, it took a tremendous toll on my mental health because when our feelings, thoughts and behaviors are misaligned, um, it's actually a recipe for a complete mental, mental health breakdown.

And so in: 2012

And so, um, taking that leave actually. I, I believe at that time did a number on my, my professional reputation, which I don't believe it does anymore because I own the story. It's part of why I do the work that I do today, but at the time it did. And while I was, in treatment and doing, the, the healing work around my mental health diagnoses of major depression and panic disorder.

gned with who we are and how [: 00:09:00

So I can help people at the intersection of work and mental health and that's exactly what I did, um, at 30 while still working full time because I had to support myself, took classes on the evenings and in the weekends, um, to earn my graduate degree in, in counseling. And during that period of study, it became pretty evident to me that the work I wanted to do with folks, um, really wouldn't be covered by insurance, uh, because they do not want to cover therapy sessions about work because work is technically not a mental health diagnosis, even though we're all in this together.

years working [: 00:10:00

hat come along with it. So in: 2018

wouldn't you know, they do. [: 00:11:00

off and I made the choice in: 2022

said to myself, Theresa, uh,: 2022

Um, I'm now three years and a couple months into, uh, Being a full time entrepreneur, business owner, coach, keynote speaker, workplace strategist, and it is the most professionally rewarding and financially satisfying, um, three years of my career. And I'll pause there, but that, that's the journey.

Theresa: Wow. Oh my God.

That was incredible hearing your journey from politics. Working on a campaign, to the Innocence Project, to the AIDS Foundation, to a total detour into commercial real estate. And I can so relate to that, going through a time there. Spending 40 plus hours a week, it feels so misaligned to what you actually want to be doing.

Going all the way to a [: 00:13:00

Katie: I always hoped I never lost hope, right?

Which is why I made so many pivots and changes and sidesteps. Cause I always had hope. I better understand myself. I better understand my needs and my goals and my strengths and my values every time it's going to get better. Um, and I think. that every time it didn't necessarily get better, but it got me closer to what was really going to be the most engaging, satisfying, fulfilling, and rewarding.

ptimism, which is one of the [: 00:14:00

Those are experiences not to ignore, um, as you are moving toward these longer term career goals.

really good, but you're not [: 00:15:00

Or the total opposite, commercial real estate, you're probably getting paid really well, but it feels totally misaligned. Do you see it too that people believe those are the only two options? And now having gone through the journey, do you still see it as the only two options? Or do you feel like, no, there is actually one?

Options where you can have both.

Katie: No, I, I do believe there, there is a middle way and it's, it's not a, a this or that either or binary because here's, here's the thing. And I was actually recording a podcast earlier today with a podcaster out of Portugal. So interesting. Um, just hitting, hitting all over the globe today.

were a lot of people when I [: 00:16:00

But that's not for me, right? And same and nonprofit, um, people who felt totally aligned with with the mission, the vision, the values and commerce and and compensation is just not that driver for them. And so I want to be careful that it's you either. Um, give up your time, effort, energy, and financial future.

You have a financial future, and it's soul sucking. Um, I, I don't, I don't truly believe it's that way because we all have different things that drive us. And the most important thing is really getting to that moment of, of self awareness to say, this is what I need. This is what I'm willing to accept. And then, the path becomes so much more clear and you can be so much more confident walking it.

ogether a bunch of different [: 00:17:00

Theresa: I love this perspective and I so agree. It's not. I don't see it as one or the other either. There are, as you said, everyone is satisfied or fulfilled by doing something different or working for a different company.

And that's beautiful. It's just about finding that place for yourself. And it's just the place for you. It's not, might not be the right place for anyone else. But it's, what is that place for you? Yes, yes, exactly. Now, with the given political climate in the US, all of that adds another factor into that decision of what feels aligned.

e worried about layoffs. Um, [: 00:18:00

Do you have any thoughts on what can help them to advocate for themselves, still make an impact in their careers, possibly step into leadership roles, even when it feels like everything is stacked against them? Thank you.

Katie: Yeah, yeah. Oh, I mean, do I have thoughts? Yes, I have. I have lots of thoughts, and I also just want to acknowledge as I'm sharing my thoughts.

So this is just one. Um, but [: 00:19:00

I was calling this summer of: 2024

People are not actually taking that work if it becomes available to them and. This stalemate of a market has now been dubbed a frozen labor market. It is a frozen labor market that is now being flooded with more than a hundred thousand federal employees, right? And we don't see that stopping anytime soon.

nd so I worry less about the [: 00:20:00

It was 10 months. Now I can guarantee, um, well, not knowing the new numbers there. They're not improving. And so for folks who are on the fence about whether or not you should start engaging with someone to help you get those materials in order, help you to prepare for interviews, brush up that LinkedIn, how to engage in networking.

upport because it is bonkers [: 00:21:00

And the truth of the matter is, DEI from my perspective now is just being used as a dog whistle for folks that are, that identify as black, Hispanic, Latino, LGBTQ. women. That's that's all the word is. It's a dog whistle for marginalized communities, not for the actual practices and policies that people were trying to enact while Joe Biden was president.

And [: 00:22:00

ould to, to emerge and win in: 2000

re is a list, gosh, I don't, [: 00:23:00

Health disparity. I'm just at the H's. Um, uh, most at risk. Uh, oppression, prejudice, race, segregation, trauma, mental health, um, underrepresented, vulnerable populations, women. These are words that are not supposed to be said. Here's how you continue to advocate for yourself. Grab that list from the New York Times and keep saying these words.

Say them in [: 00:24:00

I'm going to pause there. I just said a whole bunch of things, Theresa. What, what should we talk about there? That

Theresa: is a lot. And I love the encouragement to use the words we're not allowed to say or. As federal employees are not allowed to say, there are moments where I don't have any words for everything that is going on.

ult for a lot of people. And [: 00:25:00

So what are your thoughts on because you already very clearly said it's it's a hard labor market and I see the same thing. It is so hard. Is there hope that you can find work for a company that Does the right thing that does allow people to talk about race of marginalized communities, everything on this list, companies who still stand by their mission or vision that they have prior to Trump's administration.

Do you see that there is hope or does it feel like Right now, it's just, you gotta take what you get. Oh,

are very much going to find [: 00:26:00

ing to this not becoming our [: 00:27:00

So do what you can every day. Don't wait for somebody else to do the right thing, say the right thing, or take an action. All actions in service of, the democracy that I know. So many of us still believe in we need to be fighting for that right now. And, and a lot of that is using our voice in, in civil protest.

m Germany. So I, you know, I [: 00:28:00

So 100 percent agree. Another topic I wanted to really dive into is that at the same time, right, we're seeing so many layoffs in the U. S. right now, which I feel it really impacts also the, not the people that are not only the people that were laid off, but also the people that are still working that are now doing the work of two or three people or of being afraid going to work every day.

his, and even prior to this, [: 00:29:00

I feel like it's becoming a bigger topic . But how can we make mental health and work a topic that we talk about more? And how can we also give people tools that they can balance their professional lives and their vision with their own well being?

Katie: Yeah, I love this question so much. And I think, you know, there were the pandemic was tragic.

It was a global tragedy, a global trauma. And there's still some really positive things. I think that that came out of it for for all of us. Um, one of them being the understanding that or at least What I, I think is an understanding that we are humans who happen to work, not workers who happen to be human.

that office or opens up that [: 00:30:00

sed in, in society. And so in: 2022

y set their employee up for. [: 00:31:00

I think anyone could wind it around to say, Oh, this is all diversity, equity, inclusion. It's not. It's just good labor practices. And so, um, what's good for the most vulnerable person is good for everyone, period. And so. With the career dimension, what we're really looking at is, does the employee see a clear path for advancement and are they seeing people who look like them advance along that path?

which is exactly what you're [: 00:32:00

So one of the things I'm a huge advocate for is global pay. Um, whether I am. Working out of my home office in Chicago or down in Nashville, Tennessee, my talent and value doesn't change. I deliver the same value to my clients regardless of where I'm living. Right. And so I would really encourage employers to start thinking about that too.

instead of where that talent [: 00:33:00

And not just for them, but for their families. Because if you have an employee who's worried about paying their electric bill or worried about paying for child care, they're not going to be as focused as they could be at the work at hand when they are, when they are doing that job for you. When it comes to community, um, the folks at work, he'll.

e same thing holds true in a [: 00:34:00

If there isn't psychological safety, and at the end of the day, psychological safety, according to Dr. Amy Edmondson out of Harvard is really just the absence of interpersonal fear that I can come to work and do the best job that I can say what's on my heart, say what's on my mind without fear of retribution.

For who knows what, um, and that, that piece around psychological safety flows into the emotional aspect and the emotional dimension. And this is where I talk to leaders and employers a lot. Cause they're like, Katie, come in and help train our leaders, how to counsel. their employees. I'm like, that's not what you hired your developer to do.

hire them to be therapists. [: 00:35:00

It is my responsibility. It is my people leaders responsibility. It is the employer's responsibility in terms of training and development for those leaders and the policies they enact. Um, and so really, people leaders have more of an impact on an employee's mental health than their spouse, partner, significant other, and their therapist.

oing to be leading others if [: 00:36:00

So investing in leadership development that focuses in on self awareness, communication, and navigating conflict. Conflict is good when we do it right. It makes us better and it moves us further along. And then finally, there's the physical dimension. Um, my gosh, there are so many things to talk about here.

People like to default immediately to the Americans with Disabilities Act. It is that, and it's so much more. Again, like I said, what's good for the most vulnerable among us is good for everybody. And so here, what I really try and focus in on is Do you allow your employees to turn off slack when they close their computer for the day or when they leave the building so that they can get a full eight hours of sleep at night and have those social connections with their family and friends when they get home?

Are you giving them enough [: 00:37:00

And as an individual, I would encourage you to look at what are my needs in those five areas and what can I advocate for, for myself and for those around me, because if it's. If you're doing it in a way that's more than just about you, especially if you're a woman that is going to get rewarded. Um, and if you're experiencing a challenge with it, I promise you someone else at work is too.

mployer, don't you want your [: 00:38:00

But then the other hand, it seems in so many organizations, so unaligned with what's really happening on the day to day basis. Yeah,

Katie: it's, um, what I see that's even worse than the misalignment is just the complete lip service that's done for it. So yeah, we're invested in your mental health. Here's some free appointments with better help.

nce that can provided by you [: 00:39:00

The challenge is I can do all of those things to take care of myself. But if I come into an environment where the people are not trained to effectively work alongside other people, it doesn't matter. Um, it doesn't matter what coping skills I have and what I do to take care of myself at home. And so it's, um, really doing.

The core root work and making changes there and planting new seeds and digging up all of the weeds and the nonsense that actually doesn't move the needle and making changes to how people work and how they experience, um, whether it's 9 8 to 10, who even knows anymore, um, like you said, people are getting quietly hired to do the job of their peers and colleagues right now.

Um, Yeah, it, it, there is a lot of, of work

Theresa: to

Katie: do.

I absolutely agree, and I'm [: 00:40:00

Katie: Yeah, it's that you have And develop the courage to always take the next best step. It is a very overwhelming and anxiety producing era of humanity right now across the board in all dimensions. And the very best antidote to anxiety will always be action. So just keep taking the next best step. It's going to help you deepen that self trust.

ou get to live it within the [: 00:41:00

Theresa: Thank you for adding that, Katie. I really appreciate that. And take that next best step. If we all keep doing that.

Everything is going to look more positive every single day. Where can people connect with you and learn more about you and Encourage Coaching?

Katie: For sure. So, um, take a visit to my website, encouragecoaching. org. Uh, you can also shoot me an email at the same extension, katie at encouragecoaching. You'll get me, not an AI bot or a chat bot, I promise.

But then also follow me on LinkedIn. We post a lot of great information and content about the labor market and job searching, leadership, workplace culture. And then on Instagram, if you need some good workplace laughs and giggles amid all of this chaos, you can find us there as well at encourage coach Chicago.

to follow you on Instagram. [: 00:42:00

So thank you again for being here today.

Katie: You are most welcome, Theresa, and I'd be happy to come back and chat more anytime.

Wow. I told you this conversation was going to be something special, right? Katie's story is such a powerful reminder that finding your place, your real place doesn't always happen on the first try, or it's not even always on the third

there. And when you do this, [: 00:43:00

You can find the link in the show notes and we cannot wait to chat with you. Thanks for tuning in everyone, and I will see you next week on Career Clarity Unlocked.